when i am able to make the bubble in a MTT, I usually have a medium to short stack, and i can never end up making the final table. i always seem to suffer a bad beat or get blinded out before i can make it. what are some strategies for making the final table?
You could possibly go a very long time without a MTT FT. The variance is huge. But, first you have to forget about making the money bubble. The real bubble is the FT bubble. Who cares if you min cash? Yipeee!!! You just turned $11 into $14.57. Big deal. Do what you can to build a big stack, so that when the money bubble nears, you can abuse those nits folding just so they can min cash. Also, if you are getting blinded to zero, you have a huge leak. 5 BB is the same as 0 BB.
I would argue that the real bubble isnt even the final table, and you shouldnt even be thinking in terms of that, anyway. MTTs are normally so hugely top heavy that anywhere from 6th-9th is still a very poor payout compared to a spot in the top 3.
It'd be useful to know what structure of MTT you're talking about. Gauging the number of chips in play/average stack by final table are important in helping you select what gear to play with. Knowledge of push/fold ranges is also critical tbh.
I've heard alot of players say it doesn't matter making the money but winning.
It does if you play bad with that attitude, you still need to play well.
If your ITM % is so bad that you loss $1000 before you crack a win paying $800.
If your ITM % is good and only loss $100 before you win $800 then ITM % is important.
Steve.
No way? You mean all this time ive been deliberately playing badly its been costing me money?
Of course you need to still play well, no one said otherwise >_>. But your strategy should never be to just make the money, e.g. if you have a 6000 stack you shouldn't be sitting there timebank folding or something just to make the last 18; you want to wait for a good spot to try and sweep the blinds or score a double up, even if that means you go out in 19th, because ultimately, in terms of expected value, this is the most profitable way to play.
Did I say you where playing bad?
Its a general comment.
So you don't see ultra aggressive players with ITM % around 5 giving the excuse they only here to win.
Check there stats they loss so much money that when they win or get a good result they still lossing money, basically because there ITM% are bad.
Thats all I'm saying with regard to ITM not being important.
Yours (for example) ITM% is 20 (good for large tourneys) and makes when you win or place a very profitable thing. Get it?
I don't mind admitting I've folded to the money, but once in the money I have done some good results.
I've also made the money easy and had bad results.
Its poker. You need the cards to do well. Else we would all be millionaires.
We all have different ways of playing poker that the beauty of this game but bottom line is profit.
BTW good week for hitting hands, straight flush and Royal Flush, I rarely see one in 6 months of playing.
Steve
P.S. If we all thought the same what a boring world!!!
I played poker casually for the better part of this year, and did pretty horrible until recently. I am making it into the money, and to final tables more often than I ever did and here is what I changed:
1) Do not play when tired or distracted. I use to play throughout the day, but if work became critical I would have to leave or donk out of a tournament fast. Easy way to lose money. Play when you have time!
2) Don't be concerned about the money bubble. The money bubble is a very small return. I have found that playing consistently (and conservatively) at the beginning of the game, wait out the all in lotto (Only call all ins if you have a near guarantee), and then develop your stack from there.
3) The mid game can be very boring. I have found that I am now folding 80%-90% of my hands in this stage, and playing tight. This is where I use to screw up. I'd get so bored that I'd say "screw it, lets go all in". If you can't stay engaged in a the game, you probably should not have started to play.
4) As you approach the bubble there are opportunities to be had playing against those who are playing to reach the bubble. They don't want to lose their stacks. if they are in the blind, they'll generally don't want to give up more chips. I find betting more aggressively against these players can enrich my own stack. The last thing they want to do is commit their stack and end up out of the money.
5) When I don't concern myself with the money bubble I usually make the finals table more often (Something I have been doing far more frequently in my last 50 or so tournaments). In my personal situation - I seem to know I am on track for the finals table if I can maintain a position in the tournament in the upper 3rd of remaining entrants.
6) I use to have a bad habit of thinking I needed to get to the top 5% right away in order to have a good overall tournament result. Nothing could be farther from the truth. The added risk of donking on all ins and playing aggressively hurt me far more than I gained.
7) My finals table musings: 10th place is better than 11th but its nice to finish higher (Every placing on the finals table is much better return). First thing I do is scope out where I am in the field. if I am the shortest stack I will play aggressively. If my stack is on the low side (6th to 9th) I generally try to work with the big stacks to put out the people worse off than myself. I'd rather take 6 than 10th. If you are the shorter stacks try to avoid the big stacks if you can (not always possible). If you can make money against the shorter stacks great. As players exit the final table adjust your tactics accordingly.
8) Learn to play short handed poker. Fundamentally, I use to screw up because I didn't adequately take player count (on the table) into consideration. The dynamics of your hand change as the number of players on the table drops. At around 5-6 players hands you would normally fold actually become very playable.
9) Play some heads up tournaments. If you make it to final 2, experience can help out. Almost every hand is playable at this point. Generally the blinds are so big at this time (In a large MTT event) that any good hand should commit your stack. Don't be afraid!
Likely there will be skilled players who may take exception to some of what I am saying, but at present it has worked for me quite well. With some patience I should recoup all my losses.
Without knowing your history I can't really comment.
If this is after 40 games then you have to be patient in MTT.
I've made the final table twice (2nd and 3rd) in MTT over 1500 players, I think that was around 450 games.
I'm a moderately good player, very good players seem to able covert deep finishes into very deep finishes with good moves to get other players to fold.
How many games have you played?
Steve