Played too weak or Outdrawn by a donk???

So I played in the Stars "Outlast the Pros" tourney last night and was hoping to get some advice on a big hand early....

Please let me know your thoughts on if I played it too weak or got outdrawn by a donk???

PokerStars Game #36435747542: Tournament #219600466, $10+$1 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2009/12/08 17:00:36 PT [2009/12/08 20:00:36 ET]
Table '219600466 298' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: savageman77 (1500 in chips)
Seat 2: Belpoke (1490 in chips)
Seat 3: d@rk angel87 (1480 in chips)
Seat 4: MAIK1470 (1500 in chips)
Seat 6: oldcynic (1530 in chips)
Seat 7: RandyTAB (1500 in chips)
Seat 8: rasorsedge (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: krita2 (1500 in chips)
d@rk angel87: posts small blind 10
MAIK1470: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to savageman77 [Ah Kd]
oldcynic: folds
RandyTAB: folds
rasorsedge: folds
krita2: folds
Royalboyz is connected
savageman77: raises 40 to 60
Belpoke: calls 60
d@rk angel87: folds
MAIK1470: folds
*** FLOP *** [4d 8h Kh]
savageman77: bets 60
Belpoke: calls 60
*** TURN *** [4d 8h Kh] [2c]
savageman77: bets 140
Belpoke: calls 140
*** RIVER *** [4d 8h Kh 2c] [5d]
savageman77: bets 160
Belpoke: raises 260 to 420
savageman77: calls 260
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Belpoke: shows [5s 8s] (two pair, Eights and Fives)
savageman77: mucks hand
Belpoke collected 1390 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1390 | Rake 0
Board [4d 8h Kh 2c 5d]
Seat 1: savageman77 mucked [Ah Kd]
Seat 2: Belpoke (button) showed [5s 8s] and won (1390) with two pair, Eights and Fives
Seat 3: d@rk angel87 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: MAIK1470 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: oldcynic folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: RandyTAB folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: rasorsedge folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: krita2 folded before Flop (didn't bet)

I looked up the villains stats afterward and no big surprise he was a huge fish. Looking back at it I realize that I may have not bet enough on the turn....maybe a full pot bet gets him off???

Then like 10 hands later and I run my KK into AA and he flops a set.... Crying

Any help or thoughts would be greatly appreciated.....

Good Luck!

savageman77

Comments

I'm a PLO player, not a HE, hence my experiences says: don't slow play unless you're reaaaally huge and make 'em pay for every single card.
You raised before the flop and he called, chances are you're over him unless he got AA or he hit the K, or he's got a set. You're out of position but with preflop initiative, checking or small betting in this spot is wrong, you are probably over him, and if you check or small bet and get call you won't have any clue on what his true holdings are.
My opinion, you should have c-betted the flop, and should have done it hard with something like 2/3 or full pot, probably making him fold. Should you get call he's probably near you and you take a look at the turn, and then decide for a check and eventually smooth call his bet, if little.
What you definitely shouldn't do is betting and calling his raise on the river with the lone KK.

Anyway, he was definitely a fish but you let him follow trough by showing weakness on the flop, and I think he probably would have not folded to a big bet on the turn, it would be legitimate to think you missed the flop and you were holding something like aq or qj and the deuce is unlikely to have helped you.

I think you played it ok, however as it played id just check/call the river.

What i would have done however, is bet closer to full pot on the flop. 60 is just too small. Id have said closer to 100. then if he calls, the turn is a pretty insignificant card. with 150 in preflop, now 200 in on the flop the pot is 350. id have bet around 260. If he'd have called this, i would have believed he had a lower K or a flush draw, and would have proceeded to check call the river. Id have lost more than you did had he called the higher bet on the flop and the turn. But then in the long run when he misses his 2 pair with 58, or misses his flush draw or even has a holding like KQ/KJ id make more chips.

I know people will say well you wont always be in front vs hands like 44, 88, AA. But in my opinion these coolers are few and far between, and AK on this board is way ahead of his range, ill happily bet this flop and turn big, and check/call a river/ If he has me, he has me.

this should really be in a forum and not as a blog but i think you played it fine, you could have raised 4x pre maybe instead or more on flop or both but other than that u just got UL.

Played too weak and outdrawn.. Listen to the betsizing advices IMO

Thank you guys for all the helpful tips and insight. It is always nice to hear what winning players think of certain situations.

Of course now when I look back at the hand I agree with everyone and I shoulda bet at least the pot on the flop as well as the turn then check/call the river....

But of course it was early in the tournament and I wasn't looking to commit a lot of chips but.....blah blah blah Monkey .... bottom line is I should have been more aggressive with my top pair out of position, and I needed to realize that I wanted to end the pot as soon as possible. Note made!

jonny2jabs - I will definitely borrow the check/call on the river cause I think that makes way more sense especially if I feel that I may have been outdrawn.

Good Luck to everyone at the tables....

You dont have to bet full pot on the flop or on the turn . Around 2/3 of the pot should do it.
And you dont want him to fold on the turn.. you just want to make his mistake of calling a bigger mistake by betting harder, and then reevaluate what to do on the river.. GL Smile

HI,
Should BCCI sponsor Hockey to motivate for higher achievements after their heart warming wins?
cricket betting